Similar to the nw restriction of what you can and cannot hit. I wouldn't want it to interfere with special attacks for war purposes but if there was a way for no one to be able to ss you that didn't have at least half your land it would prevent 80% of all bs.

QZ wants this as well or similar, we spoke about it like 4 months back.

I think what we spoke about was something like if you grab someone higher acres than you, the return would be as if you grabbed someone of your own acreage or something similar to that. I don't think it will solve all problems but at least mitigate some of them. So I agree.

Yeah. It's just with the bots in play netters who play serious get to insanely large land totals. While I'd like to think everyone has absolute control of their tag, we have witnessed suiciders and topfeeds come from virtually every tag. The leaders of a clan can have the good intentions of attempting to pay it off but ultimately if there's a huge disparity in land, retals are not realistic and reps are multiple billions. It's virtually impossible to pay off something under those circumstances. Basically all this creates a situation where everyone is mad and no one wins but the person who did the hit.

Do the same for bottom feeding then, no reason people need to have more of an excuse to run low D fatties

If you want to hold your land, get defense or go to war to protect it

Bottom feeding already has a harsh NW based penalty to it and it even gets worse with DR if you hit the target multiple times over the course of the reset. The protective measures against bottomfeeding are pretty extreme and coded into EE and were not present in E2025.

And when it comes to defence. Any experienced player in any game at any time past the half-way point can break anyone else in that game at any point.

https://www.earthempires.com/ffa/49/ranks/148

Bring it on!!

On a serious note, I think bottom feeding should be even harsher, which would help create a natural land limit (where it isn't worth it to farm as opposed to stock), and thus make these ridiculously high land countries a rarity. E2025 didn't have bots to bottom feed, yeah?

no one is breaking that sin

Ya I forget about set long DR, solid point Gerd

if you are annoyed players get too much land you should reduce the number of bots. they were increased to 250% of what they were before. I like that they were increased since grabbing with a non-tyr was quite pointless with 100 bots and the game needs more than one govt but 250 is too many and I dont give a damn if the top player gets 400k acres or 50k acres, my arguements to reduce the bots are way more refined than that and have been posted on multiple boards and need not be repeated.

Either way we are getting far off topic now. You are for some reason bothered that grabbers get X times the land of all-xp people. I don't really see why. Every reset on team, primary, express, tournament or alliance there are people who clearly avoid getting land through the usual means, they stop exploring way too soon and they start cashing or whatever and they start hitting players who only tried to gain land the normal way. Now these players are clearly only in it to piss others off; they dont want the land, because then they wouldn't have stopped exploring/grabbing bots. And they didn't want to improve their country, because they know full well that the land trade will cost them and possibly end them up in a war. If it's war they want, then they will have it eventually if they keep doing it, meanwhile their targets can never get what they want, since defending oneself is impossible.
So you are left with one group of players with an impossible win condition(be they the ones who get targeted or the ones who are forced to clean up the mess) and another group of players with an exceedingly easy one. What derrick suggests here, and that has been suggested before in other forms, attempts to remedy this imbalance.

Huh? I'm not bothered that people who grab get more land than all-xers. You must have me confused with Marshal. Lol. But if you're going to change top feeding, you might as well address bottom feeding as well. Reducing the number of bots is only really good for those who hit at the right times or get to bots first. I mean, as far as I see it, netters that don't like their 'set being ruined' over getting grabbed once or twice want protection from top feeders but want to be able to abuse smaller countries than them at will. Exploring already has a pretty natural limit to its usefulness, why shouldn't landgrabbing?

I mean if the only goal is to protect landfat netters and not to re-balance grabbing in general then let's at least be honest about that.

Land gaining is balanced by build costs pretty effectively. Also by bot defense. Look at how much less acres everyone has in 1a this set. Gotta be 50k less on average for the top 20 players.

Meanwhile the nw record in tournament was set on 30k acres and the nw record in express was set with under 25k acres. In team people rarely reach 30k acres an in primary rarely 70k. So you are talking only about alliance and ffa and those are the longest servers snd they have more bots than is needed.
Humanitarians limit my grabbing every reset on 1a as after a while I can no longer hit the low nw bots. There are so many limiters to bottomfeeding and you just want more, instead of acknowledging that land would be harder to come by with 200 bots instead of 250 and that would shift the useful acreages downwards as well as make dr and cc dr get into the useful ranges.

OK sinistril you are terribly wrong about two things:


I think a vast misunderstanding about landgrabbing formulas is the foundation for this sentence which has no connection to reality. DR is a smooth function, NW-modifier is a smooth function, bots play at random times. C:C DR is a smooth function. Further, the difference between a great grabber and an average one is so much bigger than the slight variations that occur on an hourly basis. Because grabbing is all built on smooth functions without brackets or asymptotes ( if DR is between ~1.97 and 13 that is), camping targets is not a useful/necessary practice anymore.

As I said DR is a smooth function inside the range 1.97-13, which is my main arguement for keeping the bots in that range: outside that range, you got a balanced game mechanic that is no longer in play, and that is the situation we find ourselves in a lot of the time since the bot increase to 250.


Nope thats not what its about at all. If you have read anything I wrote you know that is not the truth. I want to discourage toxic playstyles that are detrimental to the game as a whole.

Be aware... a land vs land limiting mechanic could easily be abused to your detriment.

CDs, Bomb Airbases, nukes, chems, GS, BR, EM, espionage and more are all subject to such a limitation at different levels. I think it's one of the most obvious imbalances in the game as would you if it was cause dissention that required 0 troops for full damage.

I still like the idea of changing ghost acres formula to include the need for sending more than just jets for Max ghosties. Js