time once more for the debate over the no drop land rule

i realize this is too arcane for some but it comes up every single set for others

last time we discussed the reasons for the rule and the growing consensus that the rule is both ill conceived and misbegotten (see the thread on the suggestions forum).
Although slagpit and qz have never enunciated the position that the rule is in place to grant LG victims an "ethereal right to reclaim", that is the position of warster and a few other posters. if that is the rationale for the rule then surely one ought to be able to drop ghost acres acquired in an LG. the target has no right to reclaim acres which he never owned.

thanks in advance admins for your consideration

the whole point of grabbing lincoln is the produce land, how is dropping land that you just grabbed going to helping anyone at all??

i would really like to hear your reasoning behind wanting to be able to drop acres other then to be an asshole and screw people out of reclaiming thier own land.

and technically speaking it is thier ghost acres as they were acquired at the time land was taken from them.

lincoln,

try not to drop your pants anymore.

you girl

this is a war game

Lincoln im sorry but you have posted soo much stupid fluff over the past few months i have been readin the forums.


You never supply evidence to support your arguments and they are always just wild claims or wild opinions.



In regards to this specific post:
Why grab someone and then drop the acres other than to be a complete asshole. And if you want to be a complete asshole and over grab someone for no reason, then they have the right to grab their land back off you.

hmmmm...

is it possible that people really do not understand how dropping land can benefit NW?
is it possible people have forgotten that this rule is less than a year old and was never part of the game?

i have talked about it until i am blue in the face

qz has acknowledged it a few months ago after lengthy discussion on the suggestions forum
if you want to see people other than me saying that dropping land can under certain conditions benefit your NW go read those threads
slagpit understood it before i ever came to EE


the reason for the rule is neither hypothetical nor theoretical
it was put in place because someone actually did it to qz in a clan server
qz came up with the rule to make sure it never happened again
not to create the "ethereal right of reclamation".

to demonstrate how it might have occurred

let us imagine an ffa 16 country techer that was self farming and consequently some countries had little defense but relied on the DR defense and a sizeable spy base
other countries had legitimate defenses
let us further imagine that this player one day could not get back to his country before DR expired and stock was exposed
let us finally imagine that you are a farmer who happened upon this player at a time when you had a decent spy base, 140% mil strat tech, 135% weapons tech and a small air force and 80 turns

now let's run the two scenarios
one with the Land Protection act of 2010
one without
to see why qz put the rule in and how it is able to prevent LGers from increasing their NW significantly

with the anti-LGer Land Protection Act
your first hit is a rousing success acquiring tens of millions in cash, tech and several hundred acres of land and many labs
your mil strat is reduced to 35% your spal by 24%
in fact you rec'd enough cash to replenish your lost jets

your second, third and fourth hits are slightly less rousing success
and your mil strat is further reduced, as is your weapons strat and your SPAL
you go to spy on the next country, your spy ops fail but you eventually get through, you hit that country a few times further reducing your tech and your air force
you now have a bunch of worthless labs quite a bit of empty land a low SPAL and not enough tech to help your air force beat the next country
qz's rule has successfully prevented you from accomplishing anything

now let us run the scenario the way earth2025 has been played for decades prior to the Land Protection act of 2010
your first hit is identical
you tear down the labs, drop the worthless land, use the stock acquired to grow your air force and tech and you are actually stronger in every way than before your first hit

repeat process again and again

as your air force gets larger and your mil strat and weapons caches grow, you can hit larger countries
repeat process, keep growing with each hit by dumping any land that does not help you

the only limit on your growth is how many turns you have

i can hear some miscreants now saying, " of course that is true in ffa, but this is express and there are no self farming clans"

no one can deny that there are plenty of underdefended countries in express. in express you can have 360 turns to run this process
that is why i say remove the shackles from LGers and let them play

there are countless other scenarios including people who have been ABed or BRed, people who have just destroyed their labs at the end of a tech phase prior to running a teched LGer, etc

those of you who always argue that the old rules ought to be preserved, i would just ask you to remember that all i am asking for is the old rule. This rule was created to prevent a clan server problem and just tacked on to express because of the notion that all servers ought to have close to the same rules.
there is no justification for this rule on express, let us restore the game to its pure form.

are you mental?

thats rhetorical, by the way.

again i ask, how does dropping land help? the whole point of LAND GRABBING is to gain land. not the few million dollars you gained, that is why there are spy ops such as raid food stores, bomb banks, espionage. your whole premise is you grab someone on hand with stock, and drop the land to bring weapons/spal back up and use the money you gained to re buy jets. so where are you now? exactly where you were before the grab, no further because any money gained is spent buying military lost in the grab. now all youve done is ruined someone elses game play through them not being able to regain anything lost. the ONLY reason land should be dropped is during war to raise spal when necessary.

if you really want to grab people people for thier resources, why not make a thread in BS asking the mods to consider a new attack options similar to utopia where you can send a pillage attack that does not gain land but only steals the other countries resources. then you wouldnt have to worry about dropping land.

i understand the reluctance to believe that there are people who have $1.7B defended by 300k turrets, but there are
not as many as there used to be
but if you hit someone while you are fully teched and they have $1.7B you get $100M plus food plus tech plus land
that buys a lot of jets, gas and $1000 tech

threads about pillage attacks go back long before i found EE
detmer, w, gregg and a host of others have all written in favor of such attacks

pls see detmer's comments on raids

if you've done some farming and someone wants to chem kill you, inability to drop land will get you killed as you can't drop land to increase SDI. Not being killed is benefitial to nw growth.

I like the guy who claims not to play FFA explaining how FFA works...

if youve farmed people and they want to chem kill you then they should be able to. why should you be protected from the reprocussions of your actions?

if you were all explore and someone was trying to kill you, you wouldnt have an issue dropping land to save your country.

Love Pains posts

This is the 2nd awesome thread i have seen you posting in. Saves me having to reply cause you got it pretty much covered.

"you have captured 13,657 acres in the last 24 hours. you can not drop land acquired in the last 24 hours unless you are an all-x player."


you know, if dictators worked as advertised, this would not be such a problem.

oh well, thx snawdog and slagpit for a fun set.

Back in the day I would drop land to have the best private market prices, that doesn't work anymore and I've never dropped land since. I started to read your explanation of why one might want to drop land, but it was too long of a read. I like the rules as they are.