[ Irrelevant ]

Perhaps he has been spied out?

As more ops are run against a country, it becomes increasingly harder to be successful.
At least that's how it was in the past.

[ Irrelevant ]

[ Irrelevant ]

[ Irrelevant ]

You must have no troops of your own. You can only cause damage equal to a portion of your own army size (troops in this case), or a portion of your target's army size, whichever is smaller. This limits the amount of damage a small(er) country can do to a bigger one, particularly since a smaller country can always drop land to get a higher SPAL.

For example, for stealing tech, you can only steal 0.3% of your target's tech or 0.4% of your tech, whichever is the smaller value.

Edit: The % applies to each tech category too.

and what would diminishing returns be on intelligence ops, and bio ops?

it wouldnt work that way. it has always been spying out. hell, on some alliance servers, spying out your jetters and breakers can be a tactic.

Ha, That was me you were warring Celphi. I got too much networth and it said humanitarians wouldn't allow me to attack such a small opponent. Nice little war.

[ Irrelevant ]

[ Irrelevant ]

raw number of spies, along with spal, are factors in the formula

someone with 10 acres and 1000 spies will still have trouble against someone with 10K acres and 100K spies

There already is. If the spying country is less than 1/6 the land size or so, there is a penalty for the success rate.

Well at the end I calced your spal and you had 94 spal and I had 60 spal, so yours was greater than mine, but yeah certain ops are easier than others. Plus the DR took effect because all you were doing was spy ops at the end since I bought up on tanks. DR is retarded in my opinion. it seems more like a protective measure than anything else.

if countries didnt get spied out, there would be spy kills.

certain earth spin offs have no spy DRs, and your country dies in 1 hit, no chance to wall unless you are already logged in and see the ops.

SR the country to below 10 pop, 1 BR, game over.

that would greatly change the dynamics of the game dont you think?

[ Irrelevant ]

dictator and tyranny are war strats. people dont net with war strats, thats why you dont see many of them on solo servers. they are rampant on alliance servers in clans who war. Dict does have a buildings gained bonus, which makes it an efficient grabber, bur was recently nerfed and its not a large advantage anymore.

and the reason they have spied out is because you cant buy spies. imagine the suicider implications on an alliance server if spy ops just had DRs. even at min returns, if you had enough turns, you could still spy kill. it changes the entire dynamic of the game. the only way you could wall would be to drop mass amounts of land, and run turns.

[ Irrelevant ]

Celphi, I'm just going to say you haven't played this game sufficiently long (> 2 years) and/or participated in multiple wars (especially clan wars) to comment on warring vs netting. The ideology in how you run your country is completely different.

A warring country focuses on warfare, weapons, strategy and SDI techs. These techs don't boost your income. It also focuses on a decent amount of tanks and troops, and high SPAL. A warring country knowing that it will war will also build less CS, since it won't need or intend to have a huge amount of land, and that it can get a strong country earlier than a netting country that focuses on long term benefits.

A netting country focuses on Res/Bus and their main tech (farmer - agri, indy - indy), and minimally some strat/weapons, and a nominal amount of spies for spying targets to grab. A netting country runs no tanks and troops, their upkeep to attack/defense ratio is off the charts compared to jets and turrets. A netting country will typically have 1.5x to 2x as much CS as a warring one.

The way a country is built and played is different. A netting Commie with no SDI will always lose to a war prepared Dict with a large number of missiles and spies, even if the Commie has twice as much production initially. A netting country doesn't have SDI. A country might get some SDI if it thinks it might get into a war, but in this scenario, it isn't an ideal netting situation anymore, it's in the middle.

This doesn't mean a netting country can't war. If the netting country is allowed to stock a week in week 7, it can absolutely wreck havoc in week 8 of a 2 month reset, a typical war on Alliance server would have to start before a warring clan would even allow a netting clan to start stocking. Declaring war on a clan war in the middle of a switch (say tech start -> farmer) is extreme advantage to the extent espionage between clans outside of the game is a common occurrence.

Even warring on clan servers and solo servers are completely different. Clan servers focus on coordinated killing, solo servers focus on crippling economies of the opponent because solo kills are next to impossible. It is easy to cripple countries. A smaller country can "lose a war" to a bigger one on a solo server, but deal enough damage to have also crippled the bigger country out of a top 30-40 finish.


Also, your comment on Commies in the top 10 shows your lack of knowledge. Commies produce so many units that their NW is inherently high - they need to sell their units every 50 turns to even play, to accommodate this on Express server, Commies are able to sell up to 60% of their units in one sale up from the usual 35% on other servers, so a Commie on Express pretty much has to play at sell at least once every 100 turns. This is true whether it is a warring or netting Commie. They might produce a lot of units, but they need to sell 1/2 to 2/3 of these units in order to buy the techs, food and cash that they need, imagining them to be 100% used in a war is just short-sighted.


The bottom line is that a warring strategy is very different from a netting one, the country makeup/build is extremely different. A netting country can't convert to a warring one overnight simply by buying a lot of SDI and Warfare, it takes weeks to build up a stockpile of 40 missiles to fling, it is something you have to plan from Day 1 of the reset. Spies is just but one factor of a war.

I don't even know where to start Celphi. You clearly need to get better knowlage of game mechanics before you start attacking general, and commonly accepted practices in this game. That last post of yours just made me scratch my head and say wtf. I'm on my phone right now, so I'm not going to write an essay derailing your errors, but X in did a pretty good job in his last post.

Your main error is you seem to be assuming every server is a solo server. They arnt.

[ Irrelevant ]

But there lies your argument's flaw. You can't compare a Commie vs a Dict on the exact "Same CS, same tech into weapons, same IC, same SDI, same spy tech". I mean sure, you just did in your argument, but what you are really doing is comparing governments. Given identical countries, government A performs better than government B in a given scenario.

But the reality is that few people would build a Commie Indy the same way as a Dict Indy.

A warring strat picks a government type that complements a warring strategy of focusing on warring techs and military units. A netting strat likewise picks a government type that complements a netting strategy. The government bonuses is meant to amplify the strengths of your country.

In this specific example, Indies are always Commie, regardless of Warring or Netting across all servers, because the 35% production advantage is too big and trumps everything else, so this is a flawed preposition to begin with to prove the hypothesis that Dicts are weak.

[ Irrelevant ]

I think you are trying to make drastic changes to specific servers, when, in general, they have the same basic rules and interface. That would make the game a bit more complicated than it already is, and that should be voided imo.

I understand this is express talk, but making the changes you are suggesting to just this server sounds a bit silly. Part of the draw of the different servers are the mechanics are generally the same, just the playing style is different. You are getting far too specific. It's line you want each government balanced for each individual server and have an equal chance at winning. It has never worked that way, and I hope it never does.

Commies are good for early set wars, as they have a fast start, but they fizzle out on long engagments, something you don't see here on this server

fluffs are Tl really good at wars, and are good breakers because of their military strength bonuses. However their BPT deficiency is a weakness. If you AB a duct in war they are pretty fluffed

Tyrant is the best all around war government, especially if you plan on using your readiness turns efficiently. It allows you to spy, missile, and rebuild for readiness, while putting out a large number of attacks because of the lower turns needed to attack, but more needed for regaining readiness

These are just a few strengths and weaknesses, tradeoffs if you will, that balance out the war capabilities of each government. You are trying to ruin this. Not every server is a solo server, diversity is required in alliance servers.

[ Irrelevant ]

You are still limiting your experiences to just this server. Individual server changes on this scale will not be made. Widen your scope. Your lack of a broad knowlage is hindering your effective argument.

[ Irrelevant ]

[ Irrelevant ]

Because commie is only good in short sets like here on express.

Eventually a commie will outgrow it's economy unless you can sale every 4 hours on the dot and even then it is rough. Express is the only server commie can sale such a large percent of its goods, because of the fast paced nature of the server. I could be wrong on that point. It is also rough to have negative income, food, and having to buy your tech. You also dont have a tyrannies readiness turns to build or rebuild in order to expand your economy. Basically the only option for a commie is indy, and that is limiting, and not so good in a war that starts after say week 4 of an alliance of FFA set.

A dict is a far better breaker with its military strength bonus, and you can vary your strat between techer, farmer, and casher depending on the timing of the war and the server enviromant, although a dict techer is kinda like a tyr casher. Just weird. only real drawback is that it doesn't have readiness turns like a tyr, and if you AB a dict it is fluffed and a half unless it has mass stock.

Tyranny the best all around war strat because you can tech, farm, or cash if you are brave. You have 25 readiness turns to do whatever with every 19 hits, and the returns on attacks are better.

Basically, if you want to be an early war breaker or spy, go commie. Otherwise dont.

None of this applies to express really because there are no real organized wars. Commie is not a viable netting strategy on long alliance servers. Infact, I'm pretty sure express is the only server people stay commie all set long and finish well on a regular basis.

You seem to be a smart person, and your logic isn't that bad, but the scope of your information is limited, and that is throwing you off.

Also, on alliance servers a dict is better than commie at netting because of the dict gains in grabbing. The BPT and production deficiencies are outweighed by grabbing and growing fast. In reality, neither a commie or a dict are good netters unless you are a landtrading dict, and even that has been recently nerfed.

My main point is you really can't compare this server with the slower paced and longer other servers. Commie is garbage usually on other servers unless it is in an early war or early retaller. Express has what, 1799 turns? Alliance and FFA have 4319 I think. Commie fizzles out rapidly.

It's really a design deficiency that Commie is the only viable government for the Indy strat, but this dates back to 12 years ago.

Heading to work, I'll reply back later tonight.

A dictatorship has a "halo" of intimidation and deterrence. When I was on my first few sets as a D or R I was eaten alive. As a dictatorship I was hit less often and when I was hit it was easier to hit back. Playing as a dictator gave me more turns to spend growing instead of defending.

While I haven't figured out how to use the +32% building capture bonus to outweigh the -30% decrease in build rate for a netting advantage, I think it's a fun government to play on express server.

A Dictator's 25% military strength means you have the same army size with 20% less units. That is, if a Monarchy country has 125 turrets, you have the same defense if you only have 100 turrets (25/125 = 20% less units).

This doesn't seem like much, until you figure out that this means you actually need 20% less units to do anything compared to another government. You need 20% less turrets, you need 20% less jets to make a successful attack. You use 20% less oil for these attacks, and you use 20% less military expenses every turn. Now only that, your Networth is typically ~10% lower (since not all your NW comes from your military), allowing you to grab targets that are of even lower NW sitting at the edge of the 1/12 NW range on Express. A very common problem in Primary and Express is "running out of targets to hit" while trying to avoid hitting anyone more than once, so this extends your attackable range quite a bit downwards.

Since you also get a spy bonus, you also need to build less Industrial buildings (if you are not Indy strat) to generate spies (since you need less spies for the same effectiveness), allowing you to devote a larger portion of your land to actual production buildings (farms or ent/res) for your strategy. This means more income.

The ghost acres bonus gives you more pre-constructed buildings when you attack, which means you need to build less buildings (if you grab a country of the same strategy type as you) - savings that go into buying tech instead. More ghost acres also means you need to make less attacks to obtain the same amount of land. A Republic or Commie might make 30 bottomfeeding attacks to get 10k land, but a Dict might need 5 less attacks to get the same 10k. This again translates to less oil and less jets used, another savings. It is a common strategy to only attack countries of the same strategy as you on the final few attacks of the reset before entering the stocking phase to save on construction costs as it increases polynomially with land size.

The bonus is much stronger than you think, but the strength of it is balanced by having a 30% BPT penalty - you need more turns to build - which makes the Dictator extremely unsuitable for the Techer strategy. The penalty is THAT big because the 25% military strength is THAT good.

I really like playing a Dictator. Its great having almost unbeatable spies and you can get all 5 divisions mobilized and bottomfeed like crazy

Props to Xin. He is able to put it into words well.

Celphi I would just take the advice they have to give you, I mean you FSed me and I was a Democracy for the first 4 days before switching to a dictatorship for the last day and I outgrew you. You obviously don't know enough about war, netting, and most importantly you lacked any strategy to beat me, and you had the drop on me. If it were anyone else, they would have at least leveled me in the FS, but I wasnt worried because I could smell your noobness.

I beg to differ, lol.... I won vs a dict that was prepared last set haha. Just have to get your shots in fast when they aren't online with max turns :P

[ Irrelevant ]

Target ahoy!

[ Irrelevant ]

Your are starting to get kinda annoying. We have explained everything to you. I'm not going to sit here, hold your hand, and take you turn for turn through the first 1000 turns of a dict and a commie. Either read the advice up there and improve your game from it, or shut the fluff up. I'm tired of trying to help someone as hard headed as you.

This is the only server in the entire game where commie is worth a fluff through the entire set. It fizzles out on every other server. Dict is the better strat for netting or war past turn 2000. The admins are not going to change the entire game just for this tarded server that baerly has 150 players. Back into troll mode.

[quote poster=mrford; 31823; 574355]This is the only server in the entire game where commie is worth a fluff through the entire set. It fizzles out on every other server. Dict is the better strat for netting or war past turn 2000.[./quote]

Oh really?
Primary Server top 10.
I wonder why I count 4 'fizzling' commies in the top 10?' & 0 dictators... (And this set began on May 5th)

1 Do you want to build a snowman (#9) 45,955 $28,474,343 DG
2 DeLpHiNuS (#109) 31,257 $18,683,852 CG
3 Not for Love (#148) 33,522 $18,346,792 CG
4 Surface to Air Missiles (#3) 28,945 $18,210,523 CG
5 Asterix (#126) 28,616 $18,061,957 RG
6 Brandenburg (#89) 30,340 $17,346,746 CG
7 Wolfgang Amadeus Mozart (#74) 39,702 $17,309,592 DG
8 Survival of the Fattest (#107) 24,029 $17,120,148 RG
9 smile (#55) 28,130 $16,315,114 HG
10 To The Bottom (#127) 25,166 $16,195,166 RG

You mean the primary server that isn't over for another month?

There is no way you are being serious right now.

[ Irrelevant ]

Do you understand that some people switch governments through the set? Like, they might stock as a rep cashee, and then destock as a theo. Or they might run a war startup as a rep techer, then convert into a tyr farmer or dict casher for the war

You don't ever hear of a commie converting to anything. It isn't a flax able strat. You are kinda stuck, and you generally only convert in war when you have been flattened and rebuild as something different because your production blows.

You are comming back after 10 years and taking a microscope to a small aspect of the game, without taking into account the bigger picture. This is where you are failing. That is if you arnt trolling. And if you arnt trolling, you might actually be an idiot. You need to get that checked out.

If I did my math correctly, that server is on turn 1830~ so it isn't at the 2000th turn. However the 2000 turn thing was a generalization. Stop being so literal and flufftarded.

[ Irrelevant ]

[ Irrelevant ]

You start with 0 turns, and not everypne uses bonuses on turns, especially on longer servers. It has also been more than 36 days, a fact that helps your case. You are s9 good at math, but so bad at getting the right numbers to start with, lol. You are beyond my help. I regret every minute I spent actually trying.

Hopefully someone with more patience finds you and can break it down at a 3rd grade level for you. I wish you luck.