In hoping that posting this will give some members a different perspective or different view of that of a new player. You can take it with a grain of salt or maybe (and hopefully) there will be other solutions or discussions. I would like you to know that being a few weeks into this game, I have no knowledge of the politics or the history of all the alliances.(minus the bit that I read over this whole debate) As well as little knowledge of game itself.

So obviously LaF is in quite the dilemma, there leadership fell apart and I would suspect the alliance as a whole is having a rough time. Cheating in a game like this is pretty sad and those who took part in it should be ashamed. But I don't think putting all of LaF up for target fire is the best solution. What if there was a cease fire against LaF as well as for them against others for the duration of this set (or next set if need be) to allow them to catch their breathe, work out their kinks in leadership and to allow further investigation against any others who may have been knowledgeably cheating. For those who gained without knowledge or thought something was fishy and didn't take the challenge of confronting it should not take the heat of this, we should all accept that this can not be undone and take it in stride... I think there was a lesson learned (probably ones that go way over my head).

From what I understand, players are leaving the game over all of this which isn't good for the community of a small player base as is. So I don't believe that putting most of Alliance EE against LaF or to drive them out of the game will help. Maybe I am wrong but I don't think there is anonymous poll that decides who the leader of the alliance is and punishing all, I think would be unfair.

As far as the cheating goes... to that extent I would hope that neither of those two would be welcomed back to this game. All others who may have been involved and uncaught (if there are any), rethink your actions and choose to play the game to have fun and not take advantage of the hard work people put into this game to keep it running.

So looking back maybe there's a little defending for LaF which wasn't my intention but they are my thoughts. Maybe this will spark some discussion, or different ideas or maybe it wont or maybe this is all just worthless but, I figured I'd add my two sense for what its worth to the community.
And may this be my introduction to all of you =D

-I'd like to add I am a new member of PDM but in no way am I speaking on behalf of them.

"Maybe I am wrong"

Yes, you had it right on that part- you are wrong. Thanks for giving your 2 cents. That was nice and all but a spade is a spade.

new players should stfu

I agree with Red but in a much nicer way. Its just to easy for a new member to really be the puke hanlong or TC. For now, keep your thoughts to yaself.

LOL, thought it was that they shouldn't speak until spoken to?

the writing doesn't match the nick though. i would think that a kangaruu should be jumping around a bit more.

He makes some good points, deerhunter you're just too butt hurt over LaF and your history.

But I'm sure even you can agree driving LaF players away from the game who were not part of this would be bad overall for the community.

lol new players should stfu? that's a winning attitude for a game to survive, especially if people are leaving over this cheeating

@DeerHunter Fair enough, but I don't think that this post hurts anyone and like I said take it with a grain of salt if you don't like or disagree.

LaF members had no qualms driving other people away from the game, regardless of whether they knew that their leaders were cheating their arses off.

Just saying...

you just don't understand the community yet. ain't that many people left who are going to leave because another cheater got busted.

IS not like the cheating part of Laf didn`t drive away tons of legit players out of the game right ?

Is`s all about the future and nothing else ?

I also find it slightly strange that the same people that were only just recently preaching about how LaF's blindsiding are driving people from the game, are the very same people that are planning to "gangbang" LaF for the next few sets. It's going to do wonders for both LaF's and EE's memberbase. I guess what happens over the next few sets will tell whether it's "revenge" people seek, or if a lot of this is just political profiteering.

I think I should also clarify that I do not condone the acts committed by both hanlong and TC. But to strongly advocate for an anti-"driving people away from the game" argument/plea, and then not actually practise it the moment the chips are stacked in your favour, just seems a bit rich. So naturally, motives are questioned.

Want to know who profits the most? SoF, now SoF can become the super power of the game once LaF gets fluff slapped around.

At least if I were SoF I'd use this to jump to the power house of the game.

He is entitled to his opinion. As a member of PDM he is not censored (from a PDM stand point) from posting his personal opinions on AT or anywhere.

PDM does not regulate members freedom to express themselves, although right now Detmer is wishing he could regulate me I figure

;p

I am never for driving away clean players form any game. I do think it could be a good idea for clean players to leave LAF for CLean Alliances. That is my own opinion though.

I find it slightly strange that the same alliances were already planning on not pacting LaF for the foreseeable future. Ask hanlong he probably has the logs from the Evo website where we were having discussions.

If you think that certain LaF leaders cheating is going to make anybody feel sorry for the rest of them, then you're wrong.

What was it that hanlong said: "if you want to be treated like a real alliance, then you need to play by the game rules".

You really shouldn't try to speak for "anybody". I do know for a fact that people do feel sorry for the rest of our alliance that are left to pick up the pieces after something as shocking as this. If you're unwilling to accept the possibility that not everyone in LaF is as single-minded in their approach then that's your issue to resolve and you do need to re-assess the level of cynicism you're bringing to this and ask yourself if your emotions are clouding your judgement.

Either way, you're entitled to your opinion, and I do not intend to elaborate on this any further. People can make up their own minds on this. At the end of the day, actions speak louder than words. You'e more than entitled to do what you wish. But at least be up front about the motivation behind it. An eye-for-an-eye isn't necessarily the best way to settle issues.

Case in point, when LCN accidentally nuked your country last set. I was more than willing to not only offer reps on their behalf, I did not bother asking for it back this set. Even when approached by LCN reps, I told them not to worry about it as I wasn't interested. When a TIE country attacked me two-three sets go when I was stocking close to the end of the set, I just let the TIE officials know about it, but I repeatedly stated that I did not want anything in particular done about it. I have quite a few other examples. I could have made big deals out of all these little things, but I guess what I'm trying to say quite simply is that - Not everyone in LaF is the same. And for you to actually assume otherwise is extremely short-sighted on your part.

Rest assured, we are in the process of rebuilding and we do intend to make amends from the transgressions of our former members whom have now been removed from the alliance.

well, I always speak for myself and as a representative of ee when it comes to game issues.

It should be obvious when I'm doing one and when I'm doing the other:P

haven't you learned yet that nothing is obvious to some folks? To others, everything is obviously part of an underlying political agenda.

Actually... I *CAN* regulate you. I just don't want to lose my shiny new powers already ;)

Great attitude. Go retire again.



Stop projecting. People are individuals. You are the Ivan of Evo. Get over yourself.

The problem here is that most of you assholes have forgotten how to have a conversation.

Nice post Kangaruu.

+1

Thank you for your opinion kangaruu. It is nice to hear from a different perspective then some of these whiny assholes :)

SoF doesn't become the powerhouse.. unfortunantly Earth Empires is not Batman. LaF been driving people outa the game for awhile... now that everyones pissed at LaF we should bring up the "I thought we were trying to save the member base." card?? how many small alliances left cause LaF would farm them?

Umm.. none? How many small alliances left because the entire server would farm them? You act as if LaF are the only alliance to farm small tags.

Nowadays theme is the future ... no one cares about the past ( they tend to bring the past only when it is about what SOL EVo or whomever did smth bad ).

So now the theme is - save innocent LAf ...

Well ... I was shooting at LAf from day one i have rejoined this game. And not because i am politically involved or anything - but because their style of runing stuff around.

What happend next ? their leader proven to be a cheating scum.

And now Laf is the victim? ... now give me a break hypocrits.

because they are the only alliance who's had wars started again them by multiple smaller alliances each set, you never saw any other alliance get someone to get on AT to Dec on LaF for excessive farming.. they are the only ones todo that. EXCESSIVLY, they probly slowed down by 10 or 20 grabs.

Kang (I like this shortened version)

Please disregard anything DH says as he self deleted his country in a final act of "baby tantrum" due to his country name being changed.

He also likes dudes. Large ones.

Welcome to the game! Hope your stay is lengthy.

Couple of key terms for you that will help you fit in with the crowd:

1. "Maki is a POS" - This is probably the most important Earth meme ever made.
11. "LCN is ranked 11th" - Has always been true. Always will be.
3. "SOL is ranked too high" - Also true. Always will be.
4. "Gangbang" - Not as sweet as it sounds. Usually involves multiple alliances attacking one or two other alliances.
5. "fluff" - Do not get into a theoretical debate about what or what isn't "fluff". Martian has no match when it comes to debating "fluff".
6. "Trife sucks" - This might only be me who uses this. However. whenever I post something, attack a country, play a turn, point and laugh at DH, or use the restroom. I try to end that thought/action with mentally stating this.

Hope that helps you on your new venture through addiction. Good luck!

fluff!
:P

fluff that fluffing fluffer

<3 ZEN

welcome to the insanity Kang :)

Haha well thank you ZEN for the informative post! =D I'll try to keep these things in mind.

nice post zen!
Kang: I don't think alliances are planning a gangbang or on driving LaF away from the game. That's certainly not my intention at the very least.
However, when a mass scale cheating scandal affects the highest echelon of your clan, your head and public representative, then you have to understand and accept that it taints LaF as a whole, as their leadeship chose to follow this person and allow him to speak for them.

Just like if you are in a car when someone jumps out and kills somebody, you are guilty by association, unless you go report it to the police yourself etc.

This is how people treat these new members that everyone is so desirous of protecting? You tell them to stfu etc etc? Wow. fluffing pathetic community.

Hey guy. There are a lot of welcomes on this. Don't LaF me bro.

GET IT? Lumping me in with the TWO people who said something about new members.....

I didn't read the whole thread but I saw the first 5-6 posts. Too many threads to read it all :P I obviously don't refer to everyone. There are plenty of mature people here. I just was shocked as heck that people would say that fluff to someone who is apparently a new PDM member. Getting tired of the childish mouthpieces in this community :P

kangaruu: Don't be be discouraged by the assholes that troll this forum. They don't represent the majority here. This forum is just monopolized by a handful of bigmouths with no character, too much time on their hands and infant sized penises.

thats assuming he is really new and i dont think he is, even if he is new to pdm and that is a new nick he still does not have to be new how many ppl really leave this game? how many change nicks to start over? Last but not least you think TC and hanlong really are gone doubt it they most likely changed nicks or Cream went back to RD so to sum it up

I doubt he is new, I doubt you are new nice new fourm name though and new members can still stfu

Aponic, your assuming he is new...my whole thought behind my post was that he was not new just some troll.

so you can stfu my friend

Or assholes on the forums could stfu instead? Lets just go and make assumptions about all new members right? Thats a good idea. You are acting like a child. Upset that someone has a different opinion than you, making assumptions about who they are and what they are thinking, and throwing insults/yelling really loud.

IDC who makes a thread. If they are treating everyone else with respect and not talking down about anyone then they should be treated with respect.

A fairly positive post Kangaruu.


I think though the problem is that LaF created a lot of bad blood and conflicts with multiple alliances over many other issues. They won most of those conflicts with the help of exploits and or ill gotten gained information.

I think the combination of those 2 is what makes your question or philosophy about the situation hard to get to.

true, it could be Fooglmog in disguise. nope, i see a missing period, or a period missing, whichever way you want to look at it.

Locket, I don't give a fluff what somoenes opinion is. I really don't care about LaF or this issue as much as everyone does. I think like boltar they cheated they got caught and booted. So I guess I'm a asshole whatever no biggie to me. I wont lose no sleep at night over Mr Cream and hanlong being booted from LaF. To be honest since im making assumptions, they most likely did not even leave LaF and just changed nicks but no biggie. Last but not least you all act like he is the first person i told to shut the fluff up...I have randomly said that to many people but just because he is some "new player" everyone gets all high and mighty you cant talk to a new member like that. but its whatever same ppl saying the same stuff on every thread the last thing i want to see is a post by a "new member" and lets assume he is really new he can still shut the fluff up, there is enough post by people on the topic you dont see alot of other alliances releseing a offical statement but whatever defend the n00bie if you want but like i said earler he is not the first person i have told to shove it randomly in a post why i feel the need to respond to you, is crazy to me i guess because you have the nick of someone i knew in FFA if you are him you have changed, if not then o well right

@makinso that's where I was lacking in my history of this game, I don't know all the past endevours and situations that led things to the way they are now.
Essentially I was just trying to help the community if I could... obviously there are strong feelings and opinions on the whole matter which I haven't been around to learn - this leading into the assumption of me being an old member... I can honestly say that I am an "old" member, I played when I was like 14 or something when utopia was around. It must be around 10 years since then that I came to discover EE. So I am new to this with this being my first nick since the days of swirve - which if I remember correctly I used the name Zenxrush.

oh btw kangaruu if you are really new my bad.

Nice post Kangaruu.

We let them play ingame tought. We don`t farm FS them