I just wanted to let you know that I like the way you guys have handled yourselves to this point. It's rare to see a clan of that size not just crap all over the smaller tags. Some of you may know who I am, others maybe not so much but I've been playing this game for about 12 years or so and MDs foreign relations reminds me of a time when wars had a point, when DPs meant something, when the game as well as the community was fun. I'm sure this message will fall on deaf ears for the most part but I do believe it is worth pointing out. Be well aware that there are text based games that are growing. It's not at all that the people no longer find stuff like this amusing. This game is losing its core of members for another reason. It is simply that you have no option but to join one of the 3 or 4 larger tags or get bullied. I remember being in a clan of 8 members that was well respected....not farmed. When this game dies be well aware that you have alienated the people trying to enjoy this game for what it used to be, and destroyed the culture it used to have. I know you larger clans feel like you have what you want, and when you destroy the hearts of the last of the small tags and their membership quits instead of joining you, just know, YOU ruined this game...no one else did.

Having said that, MD, I donno if the leadership you have this set has played all along, but you've conducted yourself in a manner that makes this game fun again, if only for a few days. You remind me of the good old days and for that I'm grateful. People need to look at you and see how a real clan operates...or at least operated. Clans like you could outweigh the balance, and we could bring this game back to its former glory. I'm asking...begging, don't let this reunion end with this set. You could bring newbs back to interest with this game. With only 50 players here, this game could be fun, but it needs to go back to the good old days or I swear this game will die with the bullheadedness of the people who thought they were helping their large clan, when in all reality all they have done is kill off the hundreds of people who used to play this game.

+1 Md

/me wants some kudos, too.

With any luck. We will be sticking around.

A lot of people asked about the reunion set. Some may go and not play for some time. But i suspect that the vast majority will still be around for awhile at least. We dont particularly enjoy playing the game, however we enjoy the community that we have. Nobody in MD carries on with idle smack talk one way or another because we simply don't care for it.

I believe that MD has always let its actions speak for itself. We stand by what we have done and we have never (to my knowledge) backed away from our guns.

Thats how we play and thats how we will continue to play.

that's all it has ever been about.

so you think the game is still ruined & will die?

thanks...? :p

I still play it, right?

I think you have done such a good job at keeping this game alive and trying to spread the word. You need help to make it grow though.

ya, and that's a big task...

I put together a big redesign workflow doc and there are like 40 different and important tasks to complete, some which create a bottleneck for others

building a good site/game isn't as simple as just making it and throwing it out there like it was in the 90's -- to be successful today it requires a lot of time and effort, and I'm short on the time component for a bit longer

on that note, back to work!: p

IF i was Pang or a developer, i would remove diminishing returns and implement a hard LG rule of 2-3 SS/PS total per country per 24 hour period. Or even less.

Also, changing GDI to prevent more than 1 SS/PS a day would encourage new entrants.

I would also make it so that if you are in an alliance of more than 20 people you cannot enter GDI with your country.

I would also increase explore rates, and reduce or eliminate explore decay. Encouraging less lging.

I would also make LGing take 3, 4 or even 5 turns.

I would also increase the turn per hour as well as the turn stored onhand to encourage faster, more exciting play similar to Express.

If i was Pang, i'd let my boss hump me for more time on this site =)

hmmmm...I donno if that would do much. We need to change our culture.

one problem: you are not pang. you are "I".

More turns would be fun. I really like express, it's what I'm enjoying most right now with this game

express is great

I remember when we were just starting LCN and the best and ONLY pact we got was a UNAP from EoS. There were 13, maybe 15 of us in the alliance, easy pickings.

That said, with a few requests, we got a DNH from RoCK, and our handful of countries were put on their traded list, which gave us a DNH for the entire RoCKFamily hosting site.

This was back before in game tags.

Without the free handouts from the big guys in EoS and RoCK, who had absolutely nothing to gain from us, we could have been crushed.

There was a lot of charity given to start ups back in the day. LCN certainly paid it forward back in the 90's when we could.

that's all we need

We are old in MD and still living in the past :p

MD have done nothing except go back to their gangbanging ways. Nothing could be more destructive for the server. When half a dozen small tags get involved in the stupid and meaningless wars that start from stupid and meaningless gangbangs, then we will see how much of a positive influence MD has had.

MD's Earth Strategy Guide

1. Create coalition with Sof/Laf
2. Gangbang SOL + allies
3. Get mired in war for 6 months.
4. Lose
5a. Leave the game or
5b. Wait a bit and then repeat 1.

Last time MD had the balls to take an alliance or several alliances without organising some sort of bullfluff coalition, was when?

And Derrick, you're Locutus or in MD, no one posts such a bunch of complete garbage without being put up to it.

Who put you up to that post and all your garbage posts Dagga? :D

I agree, the current war MD is in will not be healthy for the server in any way.


In saying that, I must add that it should not be up to the players to be concerned about the well being of this game.

would you like a bib so you dont get any ejaculate on your shirt when you are done slobbing MD's knob?

the reason they have been so "tame" this set is because they have been involved in a war the whole time. you really think they would not be trying to push people around had they not been?

i read this post for the first time about 3-4 replies in and was going to comment "how long will it take until dagga finds his way here and gives his two cents", but figured it might've enticed him to come faster.

it took him 10 hours and 14 minutes. i'm actually a little bit disappointed in his response time, he used to be much faster at this.

but i'm pretty sure the perspective is different from derrick to MD and dagga and/or Jiman. if i was a SOL member i wouldn't necessary have a positive outlook on MD's return to this game either from what happened to them, but that's just being obvious =)

hanlong, do you think having netting alliances gang up on a war alliance will bring positive events for the members of those netting alliances?

I am not refering to the short term gains that may occur, such as revenge and glorious fun (because I know we can all enjoy this).

Was the long term effects on a war like this analyzed?

I am all for new players joining the game, but what if the wars that may occur in the future drive away more players because of actions such us the events occuring this reset?

This is my concern.

i agree with you Jiman. it probably isn't healthy.

but i also don't think it is healthy for warring alliances to play round robin "bully a different netting alliance every reset" either.

imo we need prearranged and/or a more civil way to start all wars so it can be enjoyable to all.

just like it's not positive for warring alliances to get gangbanged, it's not fun for netting alliances to be forced to fight when they are in full netting mode.

I do not think those two things are easily comparable, but I understand what your are saying.

I agree with you, for the 'sake of the server' pre-arranged wars would be good... at least for the time being until the server population grows (and as long during those pre-arranged wars netting alliances do not attempt to take advantage of those having the pre-arranged wars).

There should be very little issue with warring alliances warring one another on civil terms as long as those warring alliances still have the right to legitimately defends themselves if taken advantage of.

On the other hand, after this reset setting something like this up will prove to be extreemly difficult with all the political BS floating up in the air.

Edit:

Again, note, I do not think it should be up to the players to worry about the state of the game.

Pre-arranged wars suit netting alliances to a tee. They can pick and choose when to run a 0 troop/250k turret Rep all set long. That is the lure for a netter like hanlong.

As much as you like to dismiss what I say, the only way to continue to 'grow the community' is to have wars that are roughly even. Where any advantage one side might have is nullified by sheer good play and coordination by the other side. Wars where you risk losing in order to have a hard fought victory. That is the only way forward.

MD took us back to the dark ages, we think its bullfluff for the game, but we're happy to oblige.

As an endnote to Jiman - you are absolutely right, it is mostly up to administrators to create a decent war framework. Unfortunately, there is very little war-oriented representation at the top levels. This makes motivation to make changes that will legislate for a better war atmosphere a loong way off. It is unfortunate when reasons for not making changes based on this sets events are stated by one particular admin as (roughly) "it was SOL so who cares".

Yeah the community of a game doesn't decide the state of that game... LOL at such a silly notion.
So you have never been involved with any other online game huh?

If you want the staff of the game to control the state of the game, SoL will suffer. SoL is an infection that the server is rising up against. SoL will leave, the numbers of the server will drop. This isn't WoW where the admins can willy nilly ban accounts, because a million others and indeed the banned will pay to play.

From the sounds of it Pang tried to work with SoL and was laughed at for the attempt and trolled to the point he gave up.

I said "I do not think it should be up to the players to worry about the state of the game". I did not say "the community of a game doesn't decide the state of that game". Two completely different sentences with two completely different contexts.

Netters run with more D then the war clans Dagga ;) WHO FORCED HIM TO POST THAT GARBAGE! OMG.

it would be a great assumption except i'm not one of those 0 troop 250k turret reps. nothing about running no military and hitting explore lures me. maybe for some other netters, but it's not nice to lump us all together =)

i do agree fair even wars are fun for everyone, but who is it to decide what is fair and not fair? if a war alliance blindsides a netting one, or a group of netting ones blindsides a war one, who is the one that can call it fair?

that's actually the lure about pre-arranged war to me actually. because if its pre-arranged shouldn't both sides have agreed to a relatively fair war? that's the whole point of prearranged no? why would you agree to pre-arrange a unfair war to yourself? =)

You can think that all you want, but in any group activity be it at work, at school, at home, or online the group always decides the state of the interaction. Even something benign as a scrabble game among friends, if one chooses to challenge every word, that will change a fun game into a boring and possibly venomous game.

There never has nor never will be a point to reasoning with SoL, they have always believed they are right no matter how wrong their actions are. Congratulations though SoL you manged to annoy some of the most passive alliances in the game to the point they give up their idea of fun to eliminate you as a threat every reset.

Ill explain the difference between those two statements and their contexts...

"I do not think it should be up to the players to worry about the state of the game"
When we make choices in this game, a priority which dictates our actions should not be whether or not the game will continue to survive based on our actions or not in (the state of the game, which was the context of the subject i was refering too). I do agree our actions does decide the way we all interact in the game and how the game will end up functioning. This does not mean it should be up to us, the players of the game, to have to worry about whether the game will survive or not if we choose to do something one way or another (again, the context of the statement which i was refering too).

------

You said "the community of a game doesn't decide the state of that game". This would mean that I said that we the community does not decide the fate or direction of the game. This would mean that I said that the players do not decide whether the game is enjoyable for others or not. This would mean that I said the players do not decide the out come of playing a game through deep community relationships.
I would never say this, nor have I said this in any sense what so ever. Nor would I agree with these thoughts in any way.

Please please please Symac, before you attempt to make posts... read everything throughly. Even now your attempting to steer the thread on SOL this and SOL that. That is not the current direction of the thread.
If you happen to be trolling... try harder.

I was and had crafted a long reply showing that if it were a game with large population and ample support you could get away with that thinking but being it is a struggling and low population game that we all have to be aware of what each action will do to the community. What will be the straw that finally breaks the camels back?

It's not worth all that hand holding and nurturing bullfluff though.

You like to make the game boring and pointless to play for people who enjoy building for 2 months to achieve something. You don't think you should have to worry about what effect your actions have on the game?

Jiman, what would you do if someone succeeded in recruiting a couple hundred people, and all they did was kill SoL in the beginning of the set and then let the netgainers land farm them? Before SoL disbanded would you plead with the person who organized it to stop for the good of the game? Would you beg the admins to put a stop to it, for the good of the game?

I think so. Yet what SoL is and has been doing is far worse. SoL actually likes warring and dieing. SoL doesn't build 2 month countries. They don't invest time in mapping out exactly what brings the most networth. They don't invest their free time and set alarms when they have to come online to hit a target. They don't play the game to reach the end of the set.

If you didn't think it was okay to blindside people who invest a lot of time and patience over the course of 2 months and who generally speaking try to stay out of war... perhaps then the admins would come down against the actions taken against you, maybe the community would have your back and blast the evil gangbangers.

Don't deflect either. This is all about SoL. LCN and LaF? You think they would actually go into a long drawn out war if SoL was reasonable to them? What will it take for SoL to understand netters don't like to be FSed while they are netgaining. Does Monsters have to blind side FS you for you to get it through your head?

Thanks for the kind words Derrick. We're glad we could sort the situation between ICN and MD out in a positive way, even though we had no official relations at the time of the incident.

MD does not look to bully anyone, we do our best to ensure we resolve any situations that may arise in a good way that all involved parties are happy with.

I understand anyone in SoL will not agree. But I luckily do not have to defend MDs actions to an alliance we are at war with.

For informational purposes only:


http://www.evolution2025.com/...t=223&w=600&h=400

Yes, because everything is always about SOL -_-

I am all for wanting MD to stick around.

*wonders what "situation" MD had with RD*

Tee hee hee!

Derrick is a new member, lol. Thats pretty funny considering he was a leader in ICN back when dagga was crapping in a diaper. Hopefully someday dagga will QUIT crapping in a diaper and realize that Sol got what they deserved this set and quit whining about it.

I'm ambivalent about MD, but thus far they have exceeded expectations, its about time the precarious Sol/Sof balance was stirred up a bit. Mark my words, within a year - Sol and MD will end up on the same side in a war, its just the nature of the game.

ill be the first to qoute this post if it is the case. but it is not likely.

MD has slowed down there hits a lot in the past week. I expect MD to keep pumping out hits, not weakening simply because they are winning the war.

COMMON MD, HIT HIT HIT!

hey Derrick good to see your still playing

The same sentiment keeps getting trotted out by people who don't have any idea, the old "SOL bullies netters". That's a convenient statement. It nullifies the stupidity of the happenings this set while being completely incorrect.

How many netting alliances have been blindsided by imagnum in the last 9 months? Once upon a time you guys were crying in your milk about them. Now you've moved onto SOL to justify the prospect of bringing constant dumb wars to the game. We will always be in war, but have tried to keep the balance mostly even in order to win. We think/thought that might have been a good middle ground.

Guess not.

Personally I think that you are all right about everything. This is the alliance server and alliances will form. Netters have the right to run 0/250k countries and complain, and seek vengence or not. War alliances have the ability to war gain and FS at their leisure. SoL has a right to attack alliances as they see fit. MD has the right to defend their chosens allies, whether the reasons are right or wrong.

Really it doesn't matter. The fun about this server, is just that.. the community, the betrayals, the wars, the hatred and the reconciliations.

I think its all pretty fun.

DAGGA! WHO FORCED YOU TO POST THAT!

Jiman > MD declared an end of major war activities a while ago. We'll perform some clean up every now and then. But most of us are netting right now.

HAHAHAHAHAHA. Who is this idiot? I don't know how to quote multiple posts so here goes. If you want to know who I am ask half of the people posting here. I'd just rather read a book than your useless jarble. I just don't waste my time on AT unless I have something to say. Get it? We aren't all trolls.

Jiman: "I agree, the current war MD is in will not be healthy for the server in any way."

War is not unhealthy or healthy. It is simply part of the game. When I speak of bullying I mean ABSOLUTELY NOTHING about war. I'm talking about when an SOL country (for example) goes crazy and tees off a bunch of missiles on a country from a clan like ICN (for example). Your response would be "Go ahead and take retals...if you can." That type of attitude prohibits smaller clans from growing. If I were to show up with a 10 member clan next set...not only would you not give us a pact but you would farm us...and that's wrong. If you wanted to tagkill us for farming you, that's another story altogether. Just let the little fellas grow...for the good of the game. If they mess with you, by all means, kill away. I guess that works as a response to dagga's first post as well so lets continue.

Pain: "would you like a bib so you dont get any ejaculate on your shirt when you are done slobbing MD's knob?

the reason they have been so "tame" this set is because they have been involved in a war the whole time. you really think they would not be trying to push people around had they not been?"

I don't need a bib, I caught it all in my mouth. And in case you were wondering they had a full opportunity to bully us anyways this set. War aside, they've acted like saints and I do not care to go into detail.

Jiman: "I do not think those two things are easily comparable..."

You are dead on with this post. Netting alliances getting whacked by warring alliances is bad. Warring alliances getting gangbanged is bad. I'm sure you guys will get your retribution and I have no problem with it. We call that, warring for a point. Something I am for.

dagga: "MD took us back to the dark ages, we think its bullfluff for the game, but we're happy to oblige."

We never left dude. I'll admit, SOL had a reasonable war last set. No doubt about it. But cmon Mr. Saintly. You know good and well SOL LOVES fighting wars they know they will win. You are better than that. You are one of the best war clans ever, why do you stoop? And don't lie to me...I'm not stupid.

Symac: "Yeah the community of a game..."

Donno if that post is true or not but I wouldn't doubt it...I've had my fair share of run ins.

Symac: "There never has nor never will be a point to reasoning with SoL, they have always believed they are right no matter how wrong their actions are. Congratulations though SoL you manged to annoy some of the most passive alliances in the game to the point they give up their idea of fun to eliminate you as a threat every reset. "

One day I was in a little clan called BSS. I detagged for reasons unrelated to SOL. SOL proceded to hit me 47 times in the next 24 hours. That was probably 4 years ago now but I definitely never got recruited. I'm sure that's just business as usual.

Jiman: "This does not mean it should be up to us, the players of the game, to have to worry about whether the game will survive or not if we choose to do something one way or another (again, the context of the statement which i was refering too)."

It totally does. You've played long enough to be helpful. It's not up to the nubs to grow membership but it is up to you to at least not be hurtful.

Symac "I was and had crafted a long reply showing that if it were a game with large population and ample support you could get away with that thinking but being it is a struggling and low population game that we all have to be aware of what each action will do to the community. What will be the straw that finally breaks the camels back?"

I was going to respond to the post before this with this exact line of speaking.

archaic: "Derrick is a new member, lol. Thats pretty funny considering he was a leader in ICN back when dagga was crapping in a diaper. Hopefully someday dagga will QUIT crapping in a diaper and realize that Sol got what they deserved this set and quit whining about it."

Hahahaha. Didn't read this before I started typing and now I don't care to edit.

dagga: "We will always be in war, but have tried to keep the balance mostly even in order to win."

Why not try being the underdog? Make me surprised to see you win.

@Maverick...I tend to agree with that. Good to see you too Murf...it's been WAY too long.

P.S. can someone in SOL tell dagga to get off here? He really ruins intelligent conversation. Note that Symac and Jiman were having completely intelligent conversations until dagga started posting.