i for one love dagga's new mantra about people "playing the whining card."

when you can't stop whining about being called a whiner, you've reached an entirely new level of self-pity.

waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahgga

First off props to Nuk.
Second off.....dagga, how much time do you sit and write and edit and re edit your stupid posts?

i hate agreeing with Evo as a LaFfer, but seriously, stop making me agree with Evo dagga. only you could make me do such a thing ;P

I already answered that on the other thread.

No. You jedi talked me.

I want firm direct answers.

yoda helmet is

from other thread direct answers you shall read

Everyone can unite and acknowledge daggas SPINNNNNNNNNNNN

1) *holds hand with evo and collectively gets dizzy watching dagga spin*

2) ?????

3) PROFIT?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mg_OASph_JI

dagga must be back in his basement writing more danielle steel type crap to post here.

Danielle steel never took so many liberties with the truth.

Nor was it ever this easy to refute everything she was saying...

Wow, you guys do not understand.

Says the new member...


(Someone was going to say that eventually)

Main point= Wars for a reason, I'll get to that later:)

At the risk of being unpopular, and at my own personal amazement, I think I am going to say Dagga, had a point or two in here, but this is the case of BEING the wrong messenger. Sorry Dagga, years of posting have caught to you, and now you have a point or two, and no one will listen.


About a year ago, I really pushed hard on allinace talk, towards a more ethical form of wars, of warring allainces being more careful on who they hit, of giving the game room to breathe and to grow.

SOF netted a reset, SOF particpated in a preplanned war with ECM..they hit N/A but offered several resets of pacts (that I guess expired heh.)

SOL, mostly hit Imag, LCN and LAF.

Imag had issues with LCN/SOL for the most part.

And most of the netting allinaces, got to grow, and have.

Now the game has grown, 800ish alliance players, 700 tagged up?
which is much higher than the 450ish we were at.


I'm still not sure we are ready for this style of politics...but it was inevitable it would returns.

SOF/SOL were the 2 top dogs, laying in bed together for the good of the game.
but eventually someone wants to be No 1.

Helmet came back. We all know SOL and Helmet didn't get along too well.
SOF hit SOL's main ally RD, that could only increase tensions.

Now I don't know what led to the great divroce, what I do know is the politics began before the reset started, and then MD came back.

I hope MD stays. I consider them to hae been amongst my better friends 10-12 yrs ago.


My hope would be that if we do engage in COlation style politics we move towards a PRE-TIL era.

An allinace FS's, defender calls in, agressor calls in more allies, defenders call in more allies etc. ANd that these wars would have ingame buildups, rather than no news and just hitting. WARS For a reason. Ingame Reason.


Dagga has a point, SOL with the exception of how they treated LCN/LAF on this server hasn't really initiated a log of gang bangs, or just killing off multiple alliances for fun b/c they could, as was happening under previous ownership.

One way of interpreting this is, b/c SOL chose to change their politices for the good of the game, and they did make changes, they have been rewarded with this action...the very thing they walked away from.
I think there's a fair point there. A VERY GOOD POINT HERE! Just the wrong messanger.


But the Geneie is out of the bottle, and its hard to get it back in.


I hope we find a way to keep things at a 1-1 level for another year or so, or preplanned wars, to give the game to get to the 1400-2000K mark. I think 2k players can support agressive coalitions.

Maybe a MD/SOL 1-1?
or a LAF/LCN vs SOL handicap match?

A MD/SOF 1-1 would be fun to watch- we could call it a friendly.

Do I really think we can put the Geneie back in the bottle for a year, no.
But It would be best for the game.

i would be more than happy if this server only had preplanned wars only.

maybe the admins can program this in the game

that's the best post on this whole thread

oh, and LCN should be ranked 11th.

And still...If SoF thought they were to be hit by SOL...then why didn't SoF hit SOL? Why was it MD-LaF-LCN?...and since spinning is the word of this thread...Tell me how SOL is getting trashed for tactics and yet SoF gets 3 alliances to gangbang SOL and everyone yells "You deserved it!...

As I stated before...I just want to know. I'm not pissing or moaning..

Reckless: This is not the thread you are looking for.

See!

WARNING: tl;dr ahead.


I guess you haven't read that long post I posted up there. And if you did, you failed to either comprehend what I posted, or research the particular points I was trying to get across. And, I don't necessarily like rehashing recent history (again), but I'll do it just for you. I am going to give you ANOTHER little history lesson, but this time, I'm going to focus on some more recent history. And since this thread is more or less about SOL, this little history lesson will be all about SOL.



Earth:2025


May 29-Aug 3, 2009 reset (3 resets before Earth:2025 shut down)

SOL and SoF FS the rest of the server. SOL FSes LaF, IX, Imag, Monsters and USIMP. IX disbands.


Aug 5-Oct 7, 2009 reset (2 resets before Earth:2025 shut down)

After absolutely no hint of provocation, SOL FSes Evo at end of set for no reason and destroys them. Evo was set to get its 7th ANW crown in a row.


Oct 10-Dec 9, 2009 reset (Last reset of Earth:2025)

SOL and SoF get gangbanged by netters. In all, 10 alliances are involved (5 on each side). SOL, and all their allies, goes down in flames.


Now, you would think that when Earth:Empires was built, that everyone would want to just start over with a clean slate, and everybody did. Everybody, that is, except for SOL (and to a much smaller extent, SoF).


Dec 13-Jan 30, 2010 reset (First reset of Empires)

SOL FSes Collab, because Collab was one of the alliances that had helped the netters achieve victory in Earth:2025's last reset. But, this was a test reset, so it didn't count, right?

Feb 1-Apr 2, 2010 reset (Second reset of Empires)

Collab FSes SOL, because SOL was prepping to hit them AGAIN. SOL begins losing the war, so they call in SoF and TIE. SoF does this loop-de-loop thing where most of their members join a fake tag to get around their uNAP with Collab, which brings in Evo, NA, and DK (who no longer exist) against SOL and SoF (we hate pact-breakers). SOL gets destroyed.

Apr 3-Jun 2, 2010 reset (Third reset of Empires)

SOL FSes Evo and DK for helping their allies last reset, outnumbering them almost 2:1. Evo has lost about a quarter of their membership at this point, due to the constant fighting. DK dies instantly (and never comes back), and Evo goes into vacation. SOL then breaks a uNAP with NA and FSes them due to a cheating scandal in FFA. SOL finishes off Evo's original countries once they're kicked out of vacation.

Jun 3-Aug 3, 2010 reset (Fourth reset of Empires)

SOL FSes LCN (don't really remember why; they DID post a dual war dec against LCN and Imag, and only hit LCN afterwards, or something), and gets spanked when Omega defends LCN.

Aug 4-Oct 3, 2010 reset (Fifth reset of Empires)

SOL FSes LaF due to policy issues and LaF farming Elysium to death. LaF dies.

Oct 4-Dec 3, 2010 reset (Sixth reset of Empires)

LaF FSes SOL in revenge of what happened last reset, but SOL is prepared, and destroys LaF during LaF's FS. SOL then FSes Imag.

Dec 4-Feb 3, 2011 reset (Seventh reset of Empires)

Imag FSes SOL and gets destroyed. SOL then FSes LCN in defense of Rage.

Feb 4-Apr 3, 2011 reset (Eighth reset of Empires)

SOL FSes Imag in defense of NA (whaaatt?) and nets afterward.

Apr 4-Jun 4, 2011 reset (Ninth reset of Empires)

SOL FSes ICN and LCN because of undesirable landgrabbing last reset. Imagnum FSes SOL in defense of LCN and Imag, LCN, and ICN all get destroyed.


And now we have this reset, where SOL is being gangbanged by LCN, MD, and LaF.


Do you not see the pattern here? The pattern where SOL starts something it never finishes, and just keeps attacking netters for helping their allies against SOL the previous reset? The entirety of SOL's existence in EE has been one huge grudge war.

I'm basically trying to say...Dagga HAS no point.

No, my point and his point are right. Look at what you wrote. These are not at all gang bangs. They are wars that are a part of the game.


Idiot.

Trife knows stuff.

Hear that? That's not the sound of my point flying waaaay over your head; that's the noise that happens when you leave your mouth open too long and your brain falls out...

Well, as a former ICN member, it certainly has appeared that there was a concerted effort by all three of the war tags to drive ICN off of the server (which I might add was pretty much successful). Though Sol was less guilty than imag and sof. So the old school style politics are still here - just on a much smaller scale.

I think its still waaaay to early to come to a verdict on MD position within the alliance political arena. The Sol'ers are rightfully nervous because an MD/Sof alliance will tip the balance decidedly out of their favor and effectively ends their 2 year run as master of EE. A year ago Sof was in a bad way and it was in their best interest to not provoke sol. Now helmet has replaced ivan and it looks like Sol's turn to wear the saddle for a while. Hopefully Sof will show restraint and not tighten the bindings too tight.

A little tension is not a bad thing though.

OVATION SIGHTING.

I"m lost in all this argument stuff and politics.

YOU ALL NEED MORE fluff

I don't want to get into this much more than I already have, but I think that point is so succinct and bang on that it warrants being highlighted in reference to Reckless' points about LaF+MD+LCN.

I think that point is the core reason for this war. Honestly, how long can an alliance go around angering other alliances before the other alliances stand up and fight back? Additionally, how can that first alliance complain when it happens after they have fought the same style of war for those same sort of reasons on a consistent basis for the last year and a half?

This war is the result of the complex political environment that has been evolving for the last 2 years. I just hope that it ends up being something positive for the server and not another opportunity for alliances try to drive each other from the game.

I would suggest that starting around last June, SOL stopped engaging in as brutal a politics as they had in earth2025 and first few resets of EE>

In fact, I mentioned that the convos for a different type of evirnoment started ABOUT a year ago.

Since then the game has grown...it hasn't been perfect for anyone, LCN and ICN in particular have had some rougher stretches.

ICN from SOF/Imag
LCN from SOL


The game grew enough the politics changed, I just hope its more of a pre-TIL style, than a gangbang style.

all I'm saying.

Game needs to have more players.

Problem solved.

>.>

yep

the game needs more players.

so warmongeres have more to hit so they won't have to hit the same netters each time.

and netting alliances have more to grab.

and i hope reckless has his answer from this thread too now.

Hmmm SoF pretty much left ICN alone once we gained our members back after you FSed us and we doubled our numbers, we havent touched you since. But I cant speak for the sets before that one as I wasnt playing

I nominate this for the dumbest thread of the month award.

Jun 3-Aug 3, 2010 reset (Fourth reset of Empires)

SOL FSes LCN (don't really remember why;)
- We got called in by imag

Aug 4-Oct 3, 2010 reset (Fifth reset of Empires)

SOL FSes LaF due to policy issues and LaF farming Elysium to death. LaF dies.
- Correct, LaF tried to enforce L:L on us.

Oct 4-Dec 3, 2010 reset (Sixth reset of Empires)

LaF FSes SOL in revenge of what happened last reset, but SOL is prepared, and destroys LaF during LaF's FS. SOL then FSes Imag.
- Correct.
Dec 4-Feb 3, 2011 reset (Seventh reset of Empires)

Imag FSes SOL and gets destroyed. SOL then FSes LCN in defense of Rage.
- Called in by allies.

Feb 4-Apr 3, 2011 reset (Eighth reset of Empires)

SOL FSes Imag in defense of NA (whaaatt?) and nets afterward.
- Correct

Apr 4-Jun 4, 2011 reset (Ninth reset of Empires)

SOL FSes ICN and LCN because of undesirable landgrabbing last reset. Imagnum FSes SOL in defense of LCN and Imag, LCN, and ICN all get destroyed.
- Correct

-------------------

Let me get this straight, we either conducted war because we got called in by allies or we got overgrabbed. Every war (imag aside) has been a fair war. Last reset we declared on two alliances and another once hit us after that - we didnt call allies.

Now, it's easy for you guys to attack the poster, its easy for you (admins) to attack SOL but we've done more to keep players in the game over the last year than almost everyone else. What you dont see is what this game is now going to descend into. Endless grudgewars, competition of who can get the gangbang in first, pointless, meaningless wars that we were trying to move on from.

If you're happy to play that way, experience shows that the most established alliances will be unaffected, but on the periphery, smaller alliances with tiny footholds will collapse.

so what do you expect us to say dagga.

that only you are right and everyone else is wrong? would that make you stop posting?

I don't expect you to understand or have a coherent thought on the issue hanlong. It's ok.

yea, like everyone here posts and plays under their real names

i would have joined this group under the RD tag or not. its more about playing with people you enjoy playing with

"Oct 4-Dec 3, 2010 reset (Sixth reset of Empires)

LaF FSes SOL in revenge of what happened last reset, but SOL is prepared, and destroys LaF during LaF's FS. SOL then FSes Imag.

Dec 4-Feb 3, 2011 reset (Seventh reset of Empires)

Imag FSes SOL and gets destroyed. SOL then FSes LCN in defense of Rage.

Feb 4-Apr 3, 2011 reset (Eighth reset of Empires)

SOL FSes Imag in defense of NA (whaaatt?) and nets afterward.

Apr 4-Jun 4, 2011 reset (Ninth reset of Empires)

SOL FSes ICN and LCN because of undesirable landgrabbing last reset. Imagnum FSes SOL in defense of LCN and Imag, LCN, and ICN all get destroyed."

These are the resets I started playing... when SOL gets FS'd your still saying that its starting something it doesn't finish.. how in all that is Earth Empires is that even possible.. really someone FS's SOL and its SOL's fault for starting are war over being overly grabbed, or for not liking a retal policy..

what kinda stupidity is that.... SOL has changed the way we do things.. I'm not a Leader in SOL, nore am I anthing but a Regular member.. has MD even been a clan in EE, if not, then are they not bringing old earth into this game, and starting endless cycles of warring something? thats if they remain after this set, not sure if they'll stay, if they are, it will definantly change the political points of the game.. for good or worse, it'll be a good differnce. per say that things will change.

you are right. you are the king of coherence.

*bows down*

Because SOL won't continue this next set and use the gangbang formula on MD/LAF next set.

Right??

I'd also like to thank you dagga for continually recognizing the iMag name in this thread. We clearly don't get the recognition we deserve.

Soviet - thats the point, what other options are there? Why start this nonsense if it is only going to result in dumb war after dumb war.

And yes, I mention imag as an example of what not to be. I notice your first strikes have been limited to hitting us for the last year or so - a win for the server.

I heard you guys were getting bored of warring us. That is why we stepped out and let MD/LAF war in our place. :)

Unrelated but still lulz-worthy: http://forums.earthempires.com/...42&z=sol-announcement

Well, my name on here has been Helmet for 10 years. How many names have you had?

dagga: Personally, I have no real dislike for SOL (though when I left in 2003, you guys seemed to be getting tight with Steel and RD, which is odd, since an RD jr. member ran Ving Thor as his application to gain color status). Fast forward to today, when it seems like you guys have again used very poor judgment in picking a primary ally to build a coalition around.

There was a time when SOL and MD were close friends, and when SOL stood against everything the [old?] RD stood for, and were punished for that stance. While the [new?] RD may not be made up of the same people, its name still is a potent symbol, and too many of the returning players see that symbol as a target. By wedding SOL to that symbol of the bad old days, your leadership has made SOL a target as well.

Disclaimer: I in no way speak for my alliance, nor do I have any involvement in its foreign policy.

ponderer thats stupid. this game will never go anywhere if people still want to linger on fluff from half a decade or more ago.

Pain: there's letting go of some stupid land grab that escalated into a war, or even being on different sides of a coalition, and letting go of angst towards a group that ran thousands of multis to try (and often succeed) at driving people away from the game. Personally, I have no animosity towards those who hide behind the colors today, beyond their choice of alliance name. In my opinion, the past actions of RD, moreso than any other group or name in this game deserves to be shunned. I left the game because Mehul was not willing to take overt action against them, even after I showed him proof of their actions. I spent two solid months abusing my moderator authority to keep them banned from the forums and deleting any mention of them, mainly to get a reaction from Mehul. And in the end, after two months of people screaming to him about my abuse of mod power, he still did nothing, and I realized that RD had killed the game for him, and gave up myself and left.

Will I jump to another tag for the opportunity to hit RD? no.
Will I complain when SoF finds itself warring against them? Again, no.
Would I leave SoF if they pacted RD, or if I found myself on the same side in a war with them? Yes.
Do I understand how veteran SOL members who experienced Ving Thor are willing to remain in an alliance FDP'd to RD? No, quite frankly I don't.

I see the problem here - dagga doesn't understand the concepts of doing something purely because it's enjoyable (And I'd venture that he doesn't understand the concept of enjoyment in general given his persona here), or letting the past go.

There ya go - problem solved. Can I have my beer rations now?

butthurt over vingthor? seriously? that was 10 years ago

how the fluff are there still so many bitter children that play this game when everyone is 30+